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AnonymousAs a Daoist it is important to understand that no one can change what happened. My father committed a crime. As much as I love and respect my father, his actions indicate an imbalance in nature. Taking any action interferes with the natural course that should be talking place now. As a Daoist I will hope for the best, keep my peace, and trust nature. I believe that if my father had trusted nature, he would not have broken the law. But, since he did, he should be waiting for the inevitable reaction to his action, which is the law of nature.
AnonymousI like the way you directed the questions and remained in control of the group. I learned that especially with students, it is important for the teacher to maintain control of the situation. It made it easier for the participants to talk and to be heard. I have attempted debates in my classroom and sometimes let the students carry on too much. Your class was a great demonstration of the way a teacher should structure a debate while allowing the students a grand opportunity to learn from each other.
AnonymousI concure with my fellow Confucianist. There are two pillars of education in which I follow, the first is moral instruction and the second is the imparting of knowledge. This can be perplexing as the morality issue is concerned with my father whom has broken the law knowingly. I am with great respect and care for my elders, including those who are deceased and especially in the respect that a child, a son, should show his parents, but as my ideal fundamental nature is to follow the Li, Hsiao, Yi, Xin, Jen and Chung. Therefore does my loyalty lie with my father (Hsaio) or with the state (Chung). I believe that the (Pinyin) is stronger than the (Rujia) and my loyalty would be towards my benevolent father whom is educated and morally cultivated and if he had done something illegally or broke the law against the state then there must have been a reasonable explanation why.
MH
AnonymousMy father has intentionally broken a well known law. What is my responsibility? My parents have taught me our Mohist beliefs and I know that we all start out evil, but by following standards and through study we can be made good. My father forgot that discipline and authority are what keep us from chaos and that it is competition and partiality that lead to strife.
Do I just love my father? Is that what I would do for another elder? After all, I am to be loyal to all elders as I am to my own father. Would I just have the one who does evil punished? We are taught to reward the good and punish the evil.
My father has taught me that cooperation and universal love remedy the wrongs of scheming and strife, but in practical terms letting someone get away with a crime is not following our Mohist teachings. I think that I will respectfully have to tell my father that what he has done is evil and against our ways. I will let him know that I love him and am loyal to him as I am to all elders. I would certainly tell the authorities if another elder did such a thing. Since I must be equally loyal to elders I must turn him in. I am certain that the ruler will follow our ways and use education, love and cooperation so that my father may behave like a good person again.
AnonymousA great movie " A Bronx Tale" starring Robert DeNiro and Chazz Palminteri has given a new twist on the eastern philosophical ideaologies on the question the Chazz Palminteri gives, "Is it better to be loved or to be feared?" What do you think? just some food for thought.
MH
AnonymousHi Kathy,
I concur with what you decided to do about your father. I agree that you did what a Mohist must do under the circumstances. I can see that your hands are tied in a manner of speaking regarding this commission of a crime. See you tomorrow night.
AnonymousIf you are feared you have the full attention of the fearful. If you are loved you may ultimately be taken for granted. You ask which is better? I ask in return, which is better for what purpose? If we don’t understand the ultimate agenda, the road to that end becomes less important. If we know where we want to go, the choice of the way to get there can be identified, investigated and implemented. Good question, one man’s opinion in return.
AnonymousIt is not a question of which is better, but a question of which is preferred to achieve the greatest results. Therefore which achieves better results love or fear. Is it than a question of Good versus Evil or Dark vs. Light. I believe the Confucianist and Mohist may have preferred love, while the Legalist Fear, the Daoist are still asking why we would such a question be asked when both fear and love are controlled by nature.
MH-thanks for the reply John
AnonymousThe whole debate -and actually section on the China Philosophy- took me back to my country once again - Kenya, where I compared (back in the '60's), the philosophy adopted by our government leaders from our 'former colonialists - the British and then the American businessmen who brought a whole lot; and Tanzania which had been colonized by the Germans but who adopted quite a bit of the Chines Philosophies in the governing of their country (influenced by the Chinese as they constructed railroads in that country). My observation is that Tanzania has over the long run proved to be a more stable country because its leaders borrowed some of the philosophical ideologies from Confucsius and the Mohists etc. schools of thought, as compared to my Kenyan leaders who seemed to embrace the pretty individualistic, ambitious, 'get as much as you can' at the expense of those below type of governing. Presentations were interesting. Gonna adopt style of debating w/ my students in my disciplines - Sp. Ed and French.
AnonymousSorry I had to miss the class due to a previous commitment. I guess I would be a legalist in my devotion to following the rules of posting on this topic even though I missed the great debate.
Since I followed through on my promise to attend a program that I helped plan through the Children's Literature Council, I would haave to see myself as a Mohist -- I needed to follow through on my obligations since that worked for the greater good of my Children's Lit community. I refuse to advocate for better tools of warfare, though. Like other Mohists, I believe in peace. I do think, though, that man is basically good, like the Confucians.
The Daoists are too esoteric for me. I don't believe that there is ONE right way for everyone.
Susan Dubin
AnonymousI have to agree with the legalists about what my father deserves for breaking the law. If I let him get away with it, then everyone will think they can get away with it too, and that will weaken us. We need to punish people who break the law, even if it goes against our natural inclination to honor the family.
AnonymousThe issue: My father broke the law knowingly and I know he broke it. It is an important law. What is a Daoist to do? To whom do I owe my loyalty and why?
As a Daoist, I will practice the philosophy of wu wei (or inaction). If I do nothing, the dao will point the way for my father and the leader, as well as the law. Inaction on my part with uphold my commitment to yield to the dao. Thus, I maintain harmony and balance.
AnonymousI enjoyed the philosophical debate very much. What a great strategy to use in the classroom to help students take ownership of the material and really study without having a test to dread. Even the quieter students can gain from small and large group discussion.
AnonymousI agree, a "Bronx Tale" is a great movie! First things first, to the topic of my father. As a Mohist I have been taught universal love by my father. Knowing this my father knows that I will have to speak up about his actions. He was thoughtless and selfish, not putting others concerns before his. Because we constantly try to do the best for society, I have to put the people of my society first before my father, even if he is my elder. I cannot and will not put him before others. We all need discipline in our lives and it is quite obvious he is lacking this and putting his country first. I just hope his nonsense will not cost the country any expenditure that will be wasteful.