Session 2 (July 13) - 1994-2011: Kim Jong Il

[Jennifer Jung-Kim]

Yeonpyeong Island is occupied by South Korea, but NK says it falls within their Northern Limit Line (which goes not by distance from the costline, but conitnues the DMZ on the same trajectory out to the ocean. Since NK is alone in that assertion, the people there are South Korean. 

Interesting analogy about Hunger Games! 

[Maria Cardenas]

Today's zoom discussion was very interesting. Questions were brought that I had not thought about. I went to study abroad in South Korea in the summer of 2012. I do not remember receiving any discrimination as a perosn of color or Latina. But this may be because I stayed with the people of the program when I went out. When I went souvenir shopping the sales lady were nice and very helpful. I wouldn't go clothes shopping because I feel the clothes sizes in South Korea are smaller or they don't carry bigger clothes sizes. I went again to South Korea in December of 2016 and I enjoyed being there. I was with my sister and cousin so maybe we didn't realize anything. I do believe that Koreans would see us and assume that we were latinas even before they spoke to us. I have had that happened to us (my sister and I) when we go to other countries. They just go Mexicans. 

[Meghann Seril]

Hi Jonathan! Thank you for sharing your question about party membership. As we were discussing I was thinking about the caste system in India as there are privileges afforded to the upper castes while those in the lower castes are oppressed. I am wondering about the opportunities for non-party members to improve their status. Could this be done through marriage? Or would that be frowned upon?

[Jonathon Allen]

That's interesting (and reassuring) that you don't remember being a victim of discrimination in South Korea as a Latina. This makes me think of something Dr. Jung-Kim mentioned in our first class, which is that Spanish is also taught in many South Korean schools, in addition to Chinese and English.  I'm not sure why I was surprised by that because it's such a widespread language.  I'm curious - did you happen to hear anyone speaking Spanish at all in either of your times to South Korea?

[Jonathon Allen]

I also really appreciated reading Lankov.  He's accessible and clear.  Teaching at a girls' school, I am interested in his commentary on the role of women in South Korea and I, too, found it interesting that women were able to more free to engage in private commerce, given the free time they had on their hands.  

As an aside, I also found the part about the drugs, or "ice," in South Korea really fascinating.  Sad that Lankov said that the youth are essentially using meth, but interesting because they then transport the drugs to mainland China, which just made me think of the opium trade and how debilitating that was for China in the late nineteenth century.  

[Jonathon Allen]

Hi Meghann,

That is interesting to think about.  When Dr. Jung-Kim addressed my question, it made me want to do a bit more research on who is "approved" as a viable party member.  She alluded to the fact that, to be denied party status is to come from a "bad family," which means that at some point, someone in the lineage must have taken the "wrong side" of a Kim.  Your question is intriguing because one does assume that there's a bit of mobility within the Party, itself.  I'm curious to find out what enables someone to become of "higher rank" than others - though I suspect it's simply visible proof of undying loyalty to the Party and the Leader.

[Maria Cardenas]

Yes, I remember she said that. I do not remember hearing Spanish in South Korea in either of my visits. Besides the people from the program or my family I didn't hear Spanish. We spoke English and I remember that in my second visit my sister and I thought that Koreans knew a little bit more of the English language (the basic).

[Alyssa Yff]

Today's discussion was very interesting and I found a few items that were highlights:

1) I really appreciated the conversation about the picture of the students in North Korea.  I also was struck by Dr. Kim Jung's discussion of the image in the video and had never known that deficiencies would result in lighter hair coloring.  That was compelling.  Likewise, I had never thought that students of the elite or party members would attend school with students of lower classes.  Is this common practice within North Korea?  Do all attend "state" schools or do they have private institutions for the elite to attend as well?  If so, are the children in the picture with the red scarves lower level "elites"?

2) I also enjoyed Julie's question about the military personnel in North Korea.  As I read through our class readings, I had similar questions about the military and their training and experiences.  I found it interesting to see how Kim Jong Il moved the military into positions of power and provided gifts to win favor.  l had a few questions, we talked about the KWP members still being in prominent and powerful positions.  Is this similar to the military or would the military have higher status?   Can women serve in the military in any capacity?  

[Alyssa Yff]

Hi Laura,

I really liked your observations about the Suryong and connections to European history!  I do think that Kim Jong Il probably viewed himself as the brains of the operation as you stated.  In the articles for our discussion, the various authors illustrated that the ascension was decided early on and seemed that Kim Jong Il probably had advisors (but they weren't specifically mentioned in the articles).  I do think that he probably viewed himself as the mastermind behind these new policies.  

I had a few questions about this as well, I am curious what training in the military Kim Jong Il received.  I am also wondering If Kim Il Sung knew of his plans to replace Juche to Military First and if he supported this idea?  Maybe he was not involved at all?

[Hilda Dixon]

How did Kim Jong Il ensure regime survival?

 

Kim Jong Il transformed his government system into a military regime by gradually giving more importance to the military than the Korean Workers’ party. For instance, on October 20, 1998 he applied “songunchongchi” policy which means military first.  Certainly, through a Constitutional amendment, Kim Jong Il positioned the National Defense Commission (NDC) above the KWP (Korean Workers' Party). In fact, he stated that the military had better qualities such as more organization, patriotism, discipline, and dedication than the Korean Workers' Party that is more bureaucratic. Not to mention, the military people are willing to sacrifice their lives for the defense of the state. He substituted the military positions of all the older military people with younger North Koreans that were loyal to him. To demonstrate his attention to the military, Kim Jong IL presented a wristwatch to all military personnel on the occasion of the sixtieth anniversary of the founding of the North Korean People’s Army. As a result, most military leaders have now experienced more status. Additionally, he continually visited  the military unit to show his attention.

 

How did South Korea’s Sunshine Policy change international relations?

 

As professor Jennifer Jung-Kim stated in her video, one of south Korea’s milestone in 2000 was the Sunshine Policy Kim Dae Jung.  As we learned in our first session that after the Korean War, there has always been the longing for unification between the two Koreas. At the beginning it was not easy to establish amicable relationships between the two Koreas. As we learned in our first session both Korean governments claimed to be the legitimate one.  Diplomacy was finally enhanced between the two Koreas on February 11, 1998 under the leadership of the President of South Korea, Kim Dae-Jung.  This policy tried that both leaders engage in a continual dialogue between the two Koreas with the purpose to expand economic exchanges and the inclusion of humanitarian assistance. This policy made President Kim Dae-jung to have been awarded with Nobel Peace Prize in 2000. After the first Summit there have been two more Inter-Korea summits, one in 2000 and other in October 2007. Important Korean figures such as Chung Ju-yung, the founder of Hyundai who was from the north has made humanitarian efforts to unify the two Koreas by giving 1001 cows to the north because he sold one of his father's cows when he lived in the north to help him with his business.

 

 

[Hilda Dixon]

WOW, It was very interesting to note that as result of this kind of unofficial economy average monthly salaries have risen from $2 and $3 between 1995-2010 to more recently, salary increases of $25-40 per family

[Hilda Dixon]

I think Yeonpyeong Island is a relatively small island that have like 2,000 residents. Although there have been some confrontations from the North Korea in which some people died and there was some destruction, China is mediating negotiations regarding these types of  military confrontations in the island  because  Japan, and USA are also watching how everything unfolds. As learned the Six Party Talks can applied to this island conflict, too

[Deborah Whetstone]

I'm glad to read this discussion!  I also had questions about the need to bypass the KWP.  Morgan's comment about the new country / first succession angle makes a lot of sense; but still, with the mythological dimensions of KISs stature, I agree that even with the new country issues, all that would be needed is KIS making it known that KJI was his choice.  Is it possible that their knowledge of SK coups, etc., was more of an influence on KJIs actions than an actual need to by-pass his father's cohorts?

[Deborah Whetstone]

~ How did Kim Jong Il ensure regime survival?

First, KJI ensured regime survival by changing the focus to the military, away from the KWP that was the primary authority during his father’s reign.  KJI understood that KWPs allegiance was to his father over him, and that some of the older cadre of Party officers may work against him and any ideas he had.  Whereas KJI’s authority and ‘experience’ (such as it was) came from the military, and therefore would support him.  And if I understood correctly and KJIs ‘experience’ was lacking but given because of who he was, the military still happily accepted the attention and subsequent move to primary authority. 

Second, KJI understood a need to emphasize the military also to protect against the possible ramifications of worldwide communism collapsing by-and-large.  Focusing on creating a police state, while allowing for slightly more economic openness was a two-pronged move to protect the Kim family’s regime, more so than the ‘communist regime’.

Third, by focusing the government’s attention on developing militarily, such as nuclear weapons, there was a consequent lapse in ideological enforcement.  I was most surprised to read of the change from the entire family being sent to camps to just the perpetrator. 

 

~ How did South Korea’s Sunshine Policy change international relations?

The Sunshine Policy helped international relations between the Koreas, at least temporarily, but weakened South Korea in the eyes of the their international allies, such as the US.  SK felt a need to lessen tensions between them and the North, to limit negative effects on their (SKs) economy when NK ‘saber-rattled’.  However, it simultaneously concerned SKs allies, given that NK was still trying to develop long-range, and nuclear weapons, and the US and others felt the Sunshine Policy was enabling the North to continue that path.  So, with some channels it was positive, and in others it was seen more negatively.

 

[Hilda Dixon]

Through pictures, people can make educated guesses and take note of the struggles that North Korea have faced by being isolated from the world for so many decades. Still, pictures do not tell the complete history of what is going on in North Korea. Lankov stated that between 1996-1999 there are some guesses that around 3 million people died while the government have state that around 250,000 people have died due to famine. I wonder about these North Korean children that seem to have blondish hair, how long they have experienced malnutrition in order to reflect the lack of essential vitamins , minerals or protein in their hair through the lack of pigment production in their hair. The underground economy might be the way that North Koreans must use in order to cope with adversity.

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